Rapid Raid
Waitlist and Listme Functionality in Raid Tracker
Beahst wrote:
No, sorry my mistake. I was trying to cover my bases and didn't add it to the last thus not covering my bases and instead implying (incorrectly) exactly what you (accurately) inferred.
For #3 I assume since it didn't state "They do not need to be online to get credit" that this option checks for online before adding the event?
No, sorry my mistake. I was trying to cover my bases and didn't add it to the last thus not covering my bases and instead implying (incorrectly) exactly what you (accurately) inferred.
GL_Support wrote:
Ok, I'm a bit of a dummy and haven't had my morning coffee yet.
So..
Scenario 1:
Player: "Bob" sends a tell to me (running the tracker) "listme".
RT adds them to the waitlist. - Check
One hour goes by and the person is online, there has been one ugly scene w/ Mimiron HM but, he's down . They go offline about 30 minutes into the 2nd hour of the Raid.
End of the Raid: I import the DKP string into the site assigning 1 DKP per 60 min. (Mimiron = 1 DKP for the kill)
How much DKP is awarded to "Bob"?
Acceptable/Hopefully: 1 DKP for Mim and 1 DKP for the 1st hour on waitlist.
Scenario 2:
Player "Bob" sends a tell to me (running RT) "listme"
RT adds them to the waitlist
45 minutes goes by and Bob switches to BobAlt his crazy lock alt; he's online for the rest of the Raid. Unfortunately, no other bosses go down from scenario 1 so it's just that Mim kill after 4 hours... ugh
End of the Raid: Import string awarding 1 DKP / 60 minutes and 1 DKP for Mim kill.
How much DKP is awarded to Bob?
assumptions: members list on the website and rapid raid config are consistent and have Bob set as Main and BobAlt set as Bob's alt. Alts & Mains are combined.
Acceptable/Ideal: 4 DKP (1 per hour), 1 DKP Mim. Site would show 1 hourly + 1 boss directly to Bob and 3 hourly to BobAlt reflected in Bob's overall total.
Likely: w/ the switch before the 1st hourly DKP award, Bob would miss out on that 1st award and depending on when in the 1st hour Mim died he may miss out on that as well.
FYI: This is (*&@# awesome either way, I'll make it work! I should have searched for this functionality earlier; I've been trying to band-aid together some solution and it just ends up me having to write a bunch of crap down.
Thanks for your support and I look forward to your reply.
Beahst wrote:
No, sorry my mistake. I was trying to cover my bases and didn't add it to the last thus not covering my bases and instead implying (incorrectly) exactly what you (accurately) inferred.
For #3 I assume since it didn't state "They do not need to be online to get credit" that this option checks for online before adding the event?
No, sorry my mistake. I was trying to cover my bases and didn't add it to the last thus not covering my bases and instead implying (incorrectly) exactly what you (accurately) inferred.
Ok, I'm a bit of a dummy and haven't had my morning coffee yet.
So..
Scenario 1:
Player: "Bob" sends a tell to me (running the tracker) "listme".
RT adds them to the waitlist. - Check
One hour goes by and the person is online, there has been one ugly scene w/ Mimiron HM but, he's down . They go offline about 30 minutes into the 2nd hour of the Raid.
End of the Raid: I import the DKP string into the site assigning 1 DKP per 60 min. (Mimiron = 1 DKP for the kill)
How much DKP is awarded to "Bob"?
Acceptable/Hopefully: 1 DKP for Mim and 1 DKP for the 1st hour on waitlist.
Scenario 2:
Player "Bob" sends a tell to me (running RT) "listme"
RT adds them to the waitlist
45 minutes goes by and Bob switches to BobAlt his crazy lock alt; he's online for the rest of the Raid. Unfortunately, no other bosses go down from scenario 1 so it's just that Mim kill after 4 hours... ugh
End of the Raid: Import string awarding 1 DKP / 60 minutes and 1 DKP for Mim kill.
How much DKP is awarded to Bob?
assumptions: members list on the website and rapid raid config are consistent and have Bob set as Main and BobAlt set as Bob's alt. Alts & Mains are combined.
Acceptable/Ideal: 4 DKP (1 per hour), 1 DKP Mim. Site would show 1 hourly + 1 boss directly to Bob and 3 hourly to BobAlt reflected in Bob's overall total.
Likely: w/ the switch before the 1st hourly DKP award, Bob would miss out on that 1st award and depending on when in the 1st hour Mim died he may miss out on that as well.
FYI: This is (*&@# awesome either way, I'll make it work! I should have searched for this functionality earlier; I've been trying to band-aid together some solution and it just ends up me having to write a bunch of crap down.
Thanks for your support and I look forward to your reply.
Dachus,
Scenario 2 is pretty close to it. Hourly DKP is awarded to everyone, including wait listers, but only for whole hours they attend. However, if you would like more granularity you can assign "hourly" DKP every 30 minutes for half the value. The net DKP will be the same for most but it will smooth over the periods of time.
-Stephen
Scenario 2 is pretty close to it. Hourly DKP is awarded to everyone, including wait listers, but only for whole hours they attend. However, if you would like more granularity you can assign "hourly" DKP every 30 minutes for half the value. The net DKP will be the same for most but it will smooth over the periods of time.
-Stephen
Great tip on the .5 for 30 min.
Assuming for argument sake, 1 for 60 min.
If someone logs in and our during that hour but, they wait listed at the right time and are there for the hour, will they get the award? I guess the question is, does it remove them from the list when they logoff or when they aren't there for the award?
This will probably be answered in your response but, if someone wait lists and then bolts what happens to them?
AND, are there any other settings that need to be changed for this to work properly? I'm thinking the setting of "Log guild on boss kill"
Assuming for argument sake, 1 for 60 min.
If someone logs in and our during that hour but, they wait listed at the right time and are there for the hour, will they get the award? I guess the question is, does it remove them from the list when they logoff or when they aren't there for the award?
This will probably be answered in your response but, if someone wait lists and then bolts what happens to them?
AND, are there any other settings that need to be changed for this to work properly? I'm thinking the setting of "Log guild on boss kill"
The waitlist is designed for people to be able to log an alt and level it or farm or whatever while waiting so they will stick around on the waitlist and get credit.
The only real problem there is if the Alt ends up in the raid. The Raid Tracker doesn't know about that. So, you can check the waitlist and remove them if needed. "/rt showwaitlist"
You can remove them if you need to for any reason. I think its "/rt removewaitlist <playername>", but "/rt help" will tell you.
-Stephen
The only real problem there is if the Alt ends up in the raid. The Raid Tracker doesn't know about that. So, you can check the waitlist and remove them if needed. "/rt showwaitlist"
You can remove them if you need to for any reason. I think its "/rt removewaitlist <playername>", but "/rt help" will tell you.
-Stephen
Dachus wrote:
I had a similar question to this a few months back (this thread), but didn't get a response. I'm sure I just slipped through the cracks; I have a tendency to post my questions very late at night, after raid. Since then, it's only come up a couple times, but Dachus' question, and mine, still stands.
I ask people (rather forcefully) to let me know if they decide to log for the night, so that I can remove them. Once every couple weeks, I have someone that's just *gone* and I'm not sure when they left, and they're still on the waitlist. I'll go ahead and remove them from the waitlist at that point, but I really have no idea how much EP they're getting credited with that they didn't earn.
As stated in my previous thread, simply clicking the 'X' next to their name and deleting them from the Raid Tracker doesn't actually get rid of them. They're still on the import, and are on every hourly dkp data point up to the point where I removed them. I'd like the penalty for not checking out to be forfeiture of any waitlisted EP earned that night, and at present, the only method to achieve this is to manually adjust out whatever they earned, after the raid has been imported.
Any guidance you can provide?
This will probably be answered in your response but, if someone wait lists and then bolts what happens to them?
I had a similar question to this a few months back (this thread), but didn't get a response. I'm sure I just slipped through the cracks; I have a tendency to post my questions very late at night, after raid. Since then, it's only come up a couple times, but Dachus' question, and mine, still stands.
I ask people (rather forcefully) to let me know if they decide to log for the night, so that I can remove them. Once every couple weeks, I have someone that's just *gone* and I'm not sure when they left, and they're still on the waitlist. I'll go ahead and remove them from the waitlist at that point, but I really have no idea how much EP they're getting credited with that they didn't earn.
As stated in my previous thread, simply clicking the 'X' next to their name and deleting them from the Raid Tracker doesn't actually get rid of them. They're still on the import, and are on every hourly dkp data point up to the point where I removed them. I'd like the penalty for not checking out to be forfeiture of any waitlisted EP earned that night, and at present, the only method to achieve this is to manually adjust out whatever they earned, after the raid has been imported.
Any guidance you can provide?
Averiy,
You're between a rock and a hard place. Technically we could add a setting that would remove people from the Waitlist if they logged off.
However, this wouldn't let people log on an alt or log off and come back in 30 minutes. Or for that matter they would get dropped if they lost connection for 5 minutes.
In other words, because of the nature of games (lost connections, wanting to log an alt, etc.) the other option (not giving credit when logged off) is even more troublesome than just dealing with an occasional person who gets more credit that they should and needs to be removed after the fact. At least this way you have the record of them fairly consistently.
I'll try to think of some creative ways to handle this, but as it is now, the way it is handled is the best choice between the two obvious methods. Possibly there is another method though.
-stephen
You're between a rock and a hard place. Technically we could add a setting that would remove people from the Waitlist if they logged off.
However, this wouldn't let people log on an alt or log off and come back in 30 minutes. Or for that matter they would get dropped if they lost connection for 5 minutes.
In other words, because of the nature of games (lost connections, wanting to log an alt, etc.) the other option (not giving credit when logged off) is even more troublesome than just dealing with an occasional person who gets more credit that they should and needs to be removed after the fact. At least this way you have the record of them fairly consistently.
I'll try to think of some creative ways to handle this, but as it is now, the way it is handled is the best choice between the two obvious methods. Possibly there is another method though.
-stephen
I don't really want to remove them from the waitlist if they log. People log to alts all the time. But at present, the penalty for not "checking out" with me is forfeiting your EP, but the manual after-the-fact adjustment is more effort than just de-waitlisting them when I notice, and letting it ride. The downside to "letting it ride" is the "stick" is being removed from the "carrot" of waitlisted EP. There's no penalty for just disappearing, and hoping I don't notice until much later.
That's why I tried the "deleting the raider" method. In my mind, clicking the 'X' in Raid Tracker and removing them from the list should make it like they were never there. Is there a reason that it doesn't work this way? Should it be, and it's just not working correctly? If I delete a piece of loot, it's like it never existed for that raid. Shouldn't the players in raid work the same way?
That's why I tried the "deleting the raider" method. In my mind, clicking the 'X' in Raid Tracker and removing them from the list should make it like they were never there. Is there a reason that it doesn't work this way? Should it be, and it's just not working correctly? If I delete a piece of loot, it's like it never existed for that raid. Shouldn't the players in raid work the same way?
There is an "/rt removewaitlist <playername>" that will remove them from the waitlist. The raid attendance and the waitlist are tracked seperately. Have you tried that? If not, I would try that and see if it gets you closer to what you want.
-Stephen
-Stephen
For me, I've adjusted it into our "culture" so to speak. People are pretty good so far at saying "hey, why did xx get credit, she logged 10 minutes after and didn't come back". I had a situation lastnight where I asked someone to sit but, stay ready for a particular fight. She wasn't there, no warning but, got full credit. So, she was busted more or less. I figure if ppl do that and you dot need them anyway, it's only a matter oftime that they gquit or get removed/demoted anyway.
I have a new question today though!
If someone waitlistd w a main then logs in w an alt and waitlistd on that toon, how does the import handle that? (keeping in mind i've been on top of assigning mains and Alta in config). Do they get double?
One more quick one: is it possible to allow people to assign their own alt and main?
I have a new question today though!
If someone waitlistd w a main then logs in w an alt and waitlistd on that toon, how does the import handle that? (keeping in mind i've been on top of assigning mains and Alta in config). Do they get double?
One more quick one: is it possible to allow people to assign their own alt and main?
If both toons get waitlisted they will get double. We don't yet export the Alt/Main settings to the mod so that it can understand those relationshsips. It just sees them all as independent characters.
We don't allow people to assign alts and mains because it directly effects DKP and how it is totalled so we feel pretty strongly that should be an Admin function.
-Stephen
We don't allow people to assign alts and mains because it directly effects DKP and how it is totalled so we feel pretty strongly that should be an Admin function.
-Stephen
GL_Support wrote:
I understand and agree w/ alt/main being an admin function.. the issue is that Guildlaunch doesn't require people to sign up using any kind of name that makes sense to the character name. So you can have "Bob" signed up with toons like Xavier and Crackle. If they don't claim them or if they get created via an import it's a real pain to maintain.
Just a default setting that whatever toon they claim first or add first would be their main.
And, why is it that Guild Launch is the only forum / guild system I've come across (that's any good) that doesn't have any correlation between the toon name and the username? I guess because they join GuildLaunch to join any GL site vs. just joining the Guild Site they are going to be associated with.
Just thought I'd mention that... I'm constantly on the look out for a system to switch to that would alleviate a couple of those little 'agitations'; fortunate I haven't found one
(I pay btw..... )
If both toons get waitlisted they will get double. We don't yet export the Alt/Main settings to the mod so that it can understand those relationshsips. It just sees them all as independent characters.
We don't allow people to assign alts and mains because it directly effects DKP and how it is totalled so we feel pretty strongly that should be an Admin function.
-Stephen
We don't allow people to assign alts and mains because it directly effects DKP and how it is totalled so we feel pretty strongly that should be an Admin function.
-Stephen
I understand and agree w/ alt/main being an admin function.. the issue is that Guildlaunch doesn't require people to sign up using any kind of name that makes sense to the character name. So you can have "Bob" signed up with toons like Xavier and Crackle. If they don't claim them or if they get created via an import it's a real pain to maintain.
Just a default setting that whatever toon they claim first or add first would be their main.
And, why is it that Guild Launch is the only forum / guild system I've come across (that's any good) that doesn't have any correlation between the toon name and the username? I guess because they join GuildLaunch to join any GL site vs. just joining the Guild Site they are going to be associated with.
Just thought I'd mention that... I'm constantly on the look out for a system to switch to that would alleviate a couple of those little 'agitations'; fortunate I haven't found one
(I pay btw..... )
You can correlate your toon name to your user account easily. Just type "Toon name" as the forum name. If you run into a conflict with an existing name then type "Toon Name <Guild>" with "<Guild>" being some form of Guild tag abbreviation. Voila forum name instantly indicates the toon name.
We can't *force* a user to enter their toon name as their forum name. We take what they enter as what they want. If you want to make a policy that says otherwise you can ask your user to change the names and use a strategy above and it still looks nice and is trivial to implement.
To answer the question about why we allow this. It is because we are one of the only guild systems that lets you join as many guilds as you want with a single Guild Launch account. You can join 100 guilds on Guild Launch with one account. You may not have the same character in each game you play. So "Character Name" as "Forum Name" doesn't actually make a whole lot of sense. So, instead of forcing the issue we give you the tools to enact a "Character Name" = "Forum Name" system on your own and there is absolutely nothing keeping you from doing it.
On top of that we *do* let people choose a "Character" to show on their forum posts per guild.
We do have some things sketched out to make this easier btw. We plan to let people type a "Character Name" in when they join a guild and to always display that name per guild site whenever we display the forum name. That will remove this issue for the most part.
However, it's still an issue that easily managed with just a touch of work on the user's part already.
-Stephen
We can't *force* a user to enter their toon name as their forum name. We take what they enter as what they want. If you want to make a policy that says otherwise you can ask your user to change the names and use a strategy above and it still looks nice and is trivial to implement.
To answer the question about why we allow this. It is because we are one of the only guild systems that lets you join as many guilds as you want with a single Guild Launch account. You can join 100 guilds on Guild Launch with one account. You may not have the same character in each game you play. So "Character Name" as "Forum Name" doesn't actually make a whole lot of sense. So, instead of forcing the issue we give you the tools to enact a "Character Name" = "Forum Name" system on your own and there is absolutely nothing keeping you from doing it.
On top of that we *do* let people choose a "Character" to show on their forum posts per guild.
We do have some things sketched out to make this easier btw. We plan to let people type a "Character Name" in when they join a guild and to always display that name per guild site whenever we display the forum name. That will remove this issue for the most part.
However, it's still an issue that easily managed with just a touch of work on the user's part already.
-Stephen
Last edited by GL_Support on Mon Oct 05, 2009 9:29 am; edited 1 time in total